tried to vs has been trying to

[MichaelLu2000]

Daniel listened to the song again and again and____to write down the lyrics for almost three hours.

A) tried B) has been trying

Which one is the correct answer?

There's no other information given. Which one would a native speaker choose?

 

[jutfrank]

The answer is A.

You have to cite the source of the question, Michael. Thanks.

 

[MichaelLu2000]

The answer is A.

You have to cite the source of the question, Michael. Thanks.

It’s from a tutor teaching English in Taiwan.

 

[MichaelLu2000]

The answer is A.

You have to cite the source of the question, Michael. Thanks.

Why is B not acceptable?

 

[jutfrank]

Because it's wrong. The past tense verb listened in the first clause sets the narrative context in the past. This is a narrative sentence about the past so only a past tense verb fits.

 

[teechar]

Because it's wrong. The past tense verb listened in the first clause sets the narrative context in the past. This is a narrative sentence about the past so only a past tense verb fits.

I disagree. The acts of listening and writing down the lyrics need not necessarily be in the very same time frame. It is quite possible that he decided to try writing down the lyrics after the act of listening to the song was completed. Therefore in my opinion, both A and B are possible.

 

[jutfrank]

I disagree. The acts of listening and writing down the lyrics need not necessarily be in the very same time frame.

Do you really think that it would be fair of the question writer to change the time frame mid-sentence? That would make for an invalid question.

 

[5jj]

Because it's wrong. The past tense verb listened in the first clause sets the narrative context in the past. This is a narrative sentence about the past so only a past tense verb fits.

I don't agree. If the listening happened almost three hours before the utterance, then the present perfect is natural in the second clause.

(Written (slowly) while teechar was posting his response.)

 

[5jj]

Do you really think that it would be fair of the question writer to change the time frame mid-sentence? That would make for an invalid question.

We often change to time frame mid-sentence. there is nothing 'invalid about this.

I left Lebanon in 2004, and have lived in Czechia ever since.

 

[jutfrank]

It's not about what's natural, or what's possible. It's about what's the right answer to the question is. Are you suggesting the answer is B?

 

[5jj]

Like teechar, I think both A and B are possible.

It's not about what's natural, or what's possible.

It should be.

 

[jutfrank]

We often change to time frame mid-sentence.

Right.

there is nothing 'invalid about this.

As a test question, it most certainly is invalid.

Are we going to argue again about what makes the answer of a test question the right answer? The answer is clearly and obviously A, and the question, as it stands, is valid.

 

[jutfrank]

Like teechar, I think both A and B are possible.

Yes, of course B is 'possible', and grammatical.

It should be.

No, it shouldn't. The fact that an answer is grammatical does not make it the right answer.

 

[5jj]

As a test question, it most certainly is invalid.
[...]
... the question, as it stands, is valid.

Do I detect a lack of consistency there?

The answer is clearly and obviously A,

Both answers are clearly and obviously grammatical, possible, and therefore correct.

 

[jutfrank]

Do I detect a lack of consistency there?

No. I mean that the test as it stands currently is valid, but only if the answer is A. If the answer is B, it's invalid because there's no reason to prefer B over A whereas there is a reason to choose A over B.

Both answers are clearly and obviously grammatical, possible, and therefore correct.

You can't have two correct answers on a multiple choice question! You have to choose one.

 

[5jj]

there's no reason to prefer B over A whereas there is a reason to choose A over B.

I gave a reason to choose B. You might choose A, which I accept as a possible answer

You can't have two correct answers on a multiple choice question! You have to choose one.

If both are grammatical and possible but you have to choose one, then it's a bad question.

 

[jutfrank]

I gave a reason to choose B.

Sorry, where? How could you attempt to justify choosing B over A?

If both are grammatical and possible but you have to choose one, then it's a bad question.

Okay, we can disagree here, and usefully argue this point, which I'm very happy to do.

 

[5jj]

Sorry, where?

In post #8.

Your view is that any wrong multiple-choice answer that yields a grammatical sentence is enough to invalidate the test.

I don't accept the word 'wrong' . If an answer is grammatical and possible, it can't be wrong.

In other words, if more than one answer is grammatical, then the question is bad.

Just so I'm clear, would you confirm this is what you would argue?

It is.

 

[jutfrank]

I don't accept the word 'wrong' . If an answer is grammatical and possible, it can't be wrong.

We're miscommunicating here. By 'wrong answer' I mean any answer that is not accepted as the 'right' answer. I don't mean wrong in any linguistic sense. We're talking about the answers to test questions. For any multiple choice question, there is the right answer, and then there are one or more wrong answers. If it's not the right answer, it must be a wrong answer. If you don't 'accept' a word that is ideal for, and extremely commonly used in this sense, what alternative word would you prefer me to use?

He stirred his coffee with a __________.

a) teaspoon
b) horseshoe
c) astrolabe
d) dipstick

The right answer is a) 'teaspoon', for which you get a point. The other answers, though grammatical and 'possible', are wrong, and merit no points. The assumption behind the question is that you select the answer that fits the context best, not that you select the only answer that yields a grammatical sentence.

What we're disagreeing on is what makes a test question valid. Would you like to discuss/argue this point? If so, shall we do it here or somewhere else?

 

[5jj]

I see no point in rehashing what we have said on more than one occasion before this. My belief, strongly held, is that if an answer is grammatical and possible, it can't be wrong. Any question that requires a learner to choose between two grammatical and possible answers is bad. We should be testing/checking learners' knowledge of English, not their ability to guess what was in the mind of the writer of the question when constructing it.