[Grammar] imperative sentence in a form of declarative sentence?

[Yonsu99]

The sentence seems to be declarative at first glance, but after reading it seems that the sentence has to be imperative in terms of meaning, which has something to do with "you're saying "no" nonetheless". Does "you're saying "no" nonetheless" mean "you have to say "no" nonetheless"?

While there are many ways you can say “no” diplomatically, you’re saying “no” nonetheless.

 

[MikeNewYork]

The sentence is indicative. The end just means that the person is still saying "no" even though diplomatic language is used. There is no command or obligation there.

 

[Yonsu99]

The sentence is indicative. The end just means that the person is still saying "no" even though diplomatic language is used. There is no command or obligation there.

Then I understand since the verb phrase 'are saying(in you're saying~)' is in indicative mood, the whole sentence is declarative sentence.

 

[MikeNewYork]

Yes.

 

[Yonsu99]

Wait, isn't "While there are many ways you can say “no” diplomatically, you’re saying “no” nonetheless." serving as an imperative sentence although it's declarative?

Imperative sentence—An imperative sentence gives a command. Typically, the subject is an understood "you," although for emphasis the "you" can actually be stated in an imperative sentence. Notice that in an imperative sentence, only a one-word verb is used; if we add an auxiliary, even a modal indicating the imperative, we end up with a declarative sentence.
Close the door.("You must close the door" is declarative.)
<Grammar By Diagram>

 

[emsr2d2]

That's the same question you asked at the start, just worded differently. There is no imperative in that sentence. Where do you think it is?

 

[Yonsu99]

I didn't mention the sentence is imperative. I learned it's not imperative sentence, but after reading the excerpts from <Grammar By Diagram> and wiseGeek, the main clause "you’re saying “no” nonetheless." seems to be making the whole sentence be a declarative sentence serving as imperative in terms of meaning.

"Imperative sentences cannot have a subject other than "you." Although the subject is normally omitted from an imperative sentence, "you" can be placed in front of the sentence, and it will still make sense. For example, "you pick up those clothes." from wiseGEEK

 

[emsr2d2]

You can't reverse that rule though. It's right to say that one can only direct an imperative to someone who you would refer to as "you" in a direct sentence. In the imperative "Pick up those clothes", it's not possible to put any (unspoken) pronoun other than "you" at the front.

That does not mean that any sentence which has the word "you" followed by a verb is "an imperative in terms of meaning".

An imperative is an imperative. The personal pronoun does not appear in an imperative sentence.

A simplified version of the original is "Even if you say "no" nicely, you are still saying "no" ". There is no imperative there, hidden or otherwise. It's a statement of fact.

 

[Yonsu99]

A simplified version of the original is "Even if you say "no" nicely, you are still saying "no" ".

That's clearer and better than "While there are many ways you can say “no” diplomatically, you’re saying “no” nonetheless." :-D