(h)while

[Verona_82]

Hello,

I was very surprised when I clicked on the 'play' button:
«while»

:shock:
I've never heard anyone pronounce /h/ before /wail/. Is it common?

Thank you.

 

[birdeen's call]

Not in England, but many people say it in the US. See Phonological history of wh - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia and also Voiceless labio-velar approximant - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[Verona_82]

Thank you for the links!
I was really flabbergasted. I was taught British English but I've never heard Americans say /hwail/ either in movies or on the radio.
Live and learn :-|

 

[birdeen's call]

I'm having trouble finding examples. I'll try tomorrow if no one else does.

 

[5jj]

It's common in Scottish and Irish English. It is not uncommon in England among older speakers, especially those from the 'higher social classes' and/or those educated at public schools*.

I** find that I use /w/ in normal conversation, but /hw/ ([ʍ]) if I am delivering a formal presentation. This is probably a hangover from my days at school, when it was drummed into me that /hw/ was the 'correct' pronunciation.

* 'public schools' in Britain are prestigious private schools.
** I am 65, from the south of England.

 

[birdeen's call]

I've found a clear example: YouTube - Morgan Freeman On Black History Month (0:44 "white man").

 

[Verona_82]

Thank you for the replies! They've been helpful, eye-opening and horizon-broadening! (if I can say so).

 

[birdeen's call]

I thought you might be interested in how this Singaporean native speaker pronounces "wh" and "w".

 

[Verona_82]

I thought you might be interested in how this Singaporean native speaker pronounces "wh" and "w".

Thank you, but my PC won't open the file :-(

 

[birdeen's call]

Thank you, but my PC won't open the file :-(

I'm not an expert and I don't know what program you're using, but there's certainly some info on the web on how to open .ogg files with your program.

Anyway, in my opinion the man pronounces "w" with a slight biliabial friction and "wh" without it. But it's only what I hear, not what I know.

 

[Verona_82]

Thanks! I'll try finding a program on the internet. If I'm lucky, I'll write what I'll hear.

 

[riquecohen]

Not in England, but many people say it in the US. See Phonological history of wh - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia and also Voiceless labio-velar approximant - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Not in the northeast. I don't remember hearing it since I left the third grade (about 1949.)

 

[Verona_82]

Anyway, in my opinion the man pronounces "w" with a slight biliabial friction and "wh" without it. But it's only what I hear, not what I know.

The KMPlayer resolved the problem with the file. I listened to it several times, but didn't hear much difference between 'w' and 'wh'. Perhaps it has something to do with the speakers.

By the way, I've come across this fragment from "Family Guy"
YouTube - Meg Griffin "a hwhile"
Stupid but funny.

 

[birdeen's call]

The way she pronounces "weird" would be considered hypercorrect by some. I've found another example of this on Youtube, but it contains very strong language. I will send it to you by PM if you want.

 

[Tdol]

In Old English, wh words were written hw:

hwíl [] f (-e/-a) while, time; a long time; hour; nú ~e just now, a while ago; ealle ~e all the while; óðre ~e…óðre ~e at one time…at another time; adv ~e once; þá ~e (þe) while, whilst, meanwhile

Old English Dictionary

 

[TheNewOne]

I don't want to make a new thread for my question so I'll ask it here:
I heard a "strange" pronunciation of the word with - /wɪðh/. It was pronounced by a native speaker. Is it ok?:shock:

 

[Soup]

I don't want to make a new thread for my question so I'll ask it here:
I heard a "strange" pronunciation of the word with - /wɪðh/. It was pronounced by a native speaker. Is it ok?:shock:

I'm not sure how to read /ðh/ (with final /h/?), but /θ/ in /wɪθ/ ('with') is often unreleased, which makes it sound like /ð/.

 

[Verona_82]

/hwhip/ 0:55
YouTube - Family Guy - Cool Whip

 

[birdeen's call]

YouTube - Craig Ferguson 5/28/10D Late Late show Shirley Manson
(5:01 for example, but she does it all the time)

 

[Verona_82]

YouTube - Craig Ferguson 5/28/10D Late Late show Shirley Manson
(5:01 for example, but she does it all the time)

I had great difficulty understanding her. What she said 5:01 is a mystery for me. However, I think I heard 'hwen' a couple of times.